Mast Step Repair

A

Andyz

New Member
I own an old Laser (no 5585 from the state of NJ hull number sticker).
The mast step failed today. I found some links that pictured a mast repair kit but did not see any one selling them. Ssome questions...
Do I need the kit? I'm pretty good with WEST epoxt having rebuilt a Thistle many years ago and owning an old Essign).
The failure was at the bottom of the step and the deck is still attached (see pictures). Should I cut away the rest of the deck?

Where can I buy the kit. I'm currently on vacation on Chautauqua lake near Jamestown NY and live in Marlboro NJ??

Thanks
Andy Zangle
 
Most Laser dealers should have the mast step repair kit available - APS in Annapolis doesAPS mast step repair kit online, as does Colie Sails in New Jersey
Colie mast step repair kit

Not sure where you posted your pictures, so without seeing, it's hard to give advice. If the tube is not broken, but the bottom of the tube moves around, the usual problem is the "donut"(resin/filler mix) the secures the tube to the hull has broken and you can fix that with by adding an inspection port in the deck near the mast, and building a new "donut" with glass/resin/filler. Use the search feature on this forum to find more info, and also check out the drLaser.org site for more info
 
OK I'll try to post the pictures again. The tube is intact the bottom plywoiod ring and the fiberglass holding it in place failed

I looked at the Colie part - thanks. Is worth it to invest $300 in this boat? The hull seems sound both the deck is spongy and there are stress cracks by the cockpit and in other areas.


Thanks,
Andy
 

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Andyz said:
OK I'll try to post the pictures again. The tube is intact the bottom plywoiod ring and the fiberglass holding it in place failed ... Is worth it to invest $300 in this boat?
Click to expand...
From what you describe of the condition of the tube and your skill, I'd think it would be better and cheaper to fix the plywood and stuff at the bottom of the mast-step and just rebuild the bit of deck around the top of the mast-step. If you have some WEST epoxy and scrap fiberglass around you could probably do it for just a few bucks and a couple of evenings of work.

Hopefully MacKenzie will weigh in on this thread; he should have a pretty good idea of what might be involved.

Cheers,

Geoff S.
 
Andy,
if you have the talent, of course you can repair it on your own, ok. Otherwise, I say, you better sell this old boat to a boat-restaurator and get from him another old hull in better conditions.
You more take care of your nerves by getting a "new" used hull at all, than repair this old spongy one and don´t have the guarantee, that on another day f.e. maybe the spongy cockpitfoor breaks and such other things. Let it do an expert.
You pay f.e. 200$ more or so (you only need a new used hull) and earn this money in fewer time with your job while doing all the restaurations, is my opinion.

All I can say from about that photos from your sick boat, that this inspectionport-hole near the maststep also is "over", too. So Andy, I think, you really need a repair in the dimension like this maststep-repair-kit. And then, you also have nothing done to the spongy areas etc., you told. So, I think, you have really a "rotten apple" there at home - something for an expert (sorry to say this). Are you one?? You probably also can ask Fred Schroth ("keeldude"), if "macwas16" (Mackenzie) dosen´t call you back. Fred is THE Mr. Laserrepair (all I know) - lives in Austin or so. His email-adress, you can find somewhere at the email-list (current part) at the NA-Laserclass-webside (link to this list is here to find, if you klick (+scroll down a bit) above at this thread at FAQ in the TLF-taskline).
Good success
LooserLu
 
Tough call, I would be going for the mast step repair kit if the rest of the boat was worthwhile. If you do it without the kit, you _might_ have some luck bonding the laminate back to the core, but then you will need to a least 4-5 layers of glass/mat at least another foot outside the damaged area of the deck just to keep the deck strong (otherwise the next time it fails in strong wind it will be from the deck failing, not the donut. Make sure the core is completely dry before fixing, especially around where the port was cut out. Once the deck is done, fix the donut area.
 
Fred's (aka Keeldude) email is [email protected]
His business is:
Schroth Fiberglass
15605 Checotah Drive, Austin, TX 78734
Ph is 512-266-7467

If it were me and I was going to fix it without the kit, I would email him the pics you posted here and get his opinion on if it could be done, and maybe a few tips on the best way to do it....
 
Thanks for the help and advice. I am going to wait until I get back from vacation before deciding what to do. I'll post as I make further progress
Thanks
Andy Zangle
 
Andyz said:
Thanks for the help and advice. I am going to wait until I get back from vacation before deciding what to do.
Click to expand...
Andy, this is a good idea, and from here, the others and me give you even some advices:
Meanwhile you are in vacation, you can try, to get the hull dry (Put it in an area, where it can dry slow), for that you can start your restaurations without loosing time, if you descide to repair it yourself. Don´t forget to take something to read with into your hollydays:
www.drLaser.org

FAQ -area:
-Who can repair my Laser
-Do I need an inspection port

Maintenance & Fittness area:

-Restoring an old Laser Maststep
-Reparing delaminated Hulls/Decks
-Delamination repair.


And there is more to read. Andy, do you speak french or do you know someone at your area that is able to translate/has a dictionary (sorry, unfortunatly my French is to bad - I will need a very long time for translation from French to English as a German)? If not, its also interesting - you can see some pic´s there - I now link you via words to:

Go to the Homepage for French-Laserites www.francelaser.org
There you find an area called "Articles" - go there, and scroll down to "VI. Entretien-réparation" (means maintenance + repairings). There is a report (with some handmade pic´s), how to fix/replace a broken mastep without using the maststep-repair-kid:"Opération dernière chance {lettre Nr. 14}" (means: Operation of final possibillity (letter No. 14)).

This could be interesting for your decision.

And, Andy, I have found this at the web [I above say, many thanks to Mr. Peter Hans from Vancouver, that he made this little report public on his webside!!]:

http://www.vancouver-boat-repair.com/Laser_boat_repair.html

There you can imagine a bit how the repair will work (done by an expert), for the maststep with the repair kit.

But to say it again: Decide only after you have had a deep consluting with an expert, please (Because you also have to repair the spongy areas at he deck of your Laser).

Andyz said:
I'll post as I make further progress
Click to expand...

Andy, it would be nice, to hear from you here, how all went and, if it is possible and economical(!!), also I would more like to hear from you, that your lovely-old-but-in-the-moment-very-sick Laserboatie didn´t got to "applepie".:D

Have a great hollyday
LooserLu
 
I've done this repair a few times, both with the kit and without it. I don't find the kit all that helpful, and it's very expensive.

I make a patch that looks like the kit by building a box with a vertical 1" dia.dowel stuck in the middle. The box needs to be large enough to cover the ruined part of the deck, plus a few inches. I use the vertical dowel to support the old mast tube at the right height and position, and then pour whitened West (WE) into the box about 1/4 inch deep, fill with some glass, then glass up the sides of the old tube. Use a couple of layers of wax paper for a release agent. When you pull it apart, you may have to grind or file the mast hole to reshape it, as some WE will leak into it. And you can sand the topside and edges of the patch to clean it up cosmetically.

Then cut the old deck away, saving as much as possible, mark the mast position on the gunnels, so you know where it goes later. Remove ALL of the old donut and glass holding it with a prybar, and grind it to expose the glass a bit. Build a new donut and WE it in place. Cut an inspection port outside of the patch area, but close enough that you can reach in. Do not put this on the centerline, as there is a wooden beam there you want to preserve. WE the patch in place as best you can, then fill the tube to the desired height to seal the bottom. Reach in and glass the outside of the tube to the donut. Then turn the boat over, suspend it and level it. Then you can pour WE into the space where the deck was cut away to really connect the patch to the hull, and stiffen this area. It will self level and creep into any space between the patch and the hull.

This should cost about $50. and add less than 4 lbs. to the boat. It will be bombproof, and should look good enough to not devalue the hull too much. Time is hard to estimate because you have to wait a day between all the steps I mention above. Leave a drop light on inside the boat to dry it before using the WE.

Good luck

Al Russell 66451
 
BTW, those pictures should be titled "Where NOT to put an inspection port!".

I put mine at least 8" from the mast, behind the mast hole and off center. Then I use the port to glass in the tube/donut before it fails, as usually the wet wood has expanded enough to crack the original glass holding the donut.

No offense intended, of course. :)

Al Russell 66451
 
Al - No offense, I got bought the boat several years age with the port already in.


After reading some of the laser Faq's and sites, I've determined that the boat number is 873. Does anybody know what year it was made? also will the age make it more difficult to repair?

Thanks,
Andy
 
Hi again,

If that's really the number, it was built in '74 or 5. 30 Years is pretty good life I'd say. I did this repair on No. 1041, of the same vintage, about 15-18 yrs ago, and don't recall any major differences from 66458, which I repaired last winter, and have described previously. All of the soft deck or hull issues may described by others may dissuade you from bothering, as the finished value will still not be great. Of course, the bottom finish matters too, and would usally be pretty beat up after 30 years.

Otherwise, you might look for a hull on ebay. Sometimes they are available? Or make it a winter project, in the basement, which is the only way I'd consider doing it.

I'd rip out the mast tube and piece of deck still attached to it, then rip out the donut/glass with a flatbar. This takes about 15 minutes. If what you find seems firm, then it will be an easier decision.

Good luck,

Al Russell 66451
 
I've moved the boat into my garage and am letting it dry out. My current inclination is to get a new hull and dispose of this one.
There are existing repairs in at least the stem, and the bottom of the hull near the stern. In at least one area, there is a leak betwen the hull and deck. Finally although the hull seems stiff in the are of the mast step, the deck is pretty spongy in many areas.

The number -873 was found below the fitting on the deck near the bow. I took off the fitting to make sure there were only 3 numbers.

Thanks,
Andy
:confused:
 
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